New Member needs advice on moving a C250

[c2506155]

Greetings all,

It's nice to be somewhere that people understand how it can be totally reasonable to spend money on machines that were made 100 years ago. And by extension, also understand that sometimes a purchase like that is not planned but you just stumble into it anyway. This is one of those stories.

I just purchased an Edison C250 at an estate sale on the West Coast. Somebody had already stolen the crank on the first day of the sale by the time I saw the unit. Perhaps they did so in hopes that the lack of the crank would keep anyone else from buying it and that they could then return on the last day of the sale and pick it up at a deep discount. If so, I was happy to thwart their plans.

However, I would like to ask for some help in how to transport the phonograph.

I am unable to transport the unit in an upright position without renting a truck and was wondering if I would be getting way over my head if I were to remove the trim plate, and then the actual mechanism, to be transported flat so that no oil/grease leaks out, and then lay the cabinet on its side for its journey to its new home?

If not, what method of transport would you suggest?

This board was a great resource to me last night in getting me started from square one to the point where I felt ok making the purchase and I'm hoping for a bit of help now, and to be able to share and contribute what I can about my machine in the future.

In the meantime here are some quick and dirty details:

As stated, the 250 was missing its crank, and also its keys, but otherwise appeared to be in fairly good condition.
The Serial number is SM 6155, which if I had read things correctly indicates that this machine was produced in the first year of manufacture.
It has the quartersawn oak upright cabinet, perhaps even the original speaker grill cloth, but does not appear to have any casters.
As part of a package deal on the phonograph I also picked up a three tier barrister style, glass door record cabinet (also in quartersawn oak) which appears to have been made for Diamond Discs based on the width of the numbered slots. 
About 300 Diamond Disc records were included in the sale, of which I'd estimate somewhere between 10% to 25% show what I think is the type of delamination typical from a disc absorbing water.

As impulse buys go, a 100 year old phonograph, a matching record cabinet, and 300 records, is a big departure for me. However, I do not think I'm going to regret it.

Thanks for any pointers on moving the unit, pictures will follow, and rest assured that I won't be attempting to play it until a proper assessment of the mechanism and diamond stylus is made.

Sorry for the "wall 'o text"

Blake

[phonogfp]

Hello Blake,

Sounds like you made an interesting buy - - congratulations.

Regarding transporting your C-250, I have two recommended methods:

A) EASIER BUT POTENTIALLY DAMAGING IF YOU'RE CARELESS:

1) Remove the reproducer by turning the knurled sleeve at the top of the horn and gently pulling the reproducer toward the front of the machine.
2) Remove the turntable by pulling it straight up away from the metal motor plate.
3) Turn the speed control knob to "off" or "0".
4) Move the horn all the way to the right, then lower the horn by positioning the wooden lever in an upright position.
5) Remove the front grille. Wad up a couple of pieces of newspaper and, reaching through the aperture formerly occupied by the grille, stuff them between the top of the feed rack (the bare metal fan-shaped component) and the bottom of the motor plate. This is to prevent the horn from moving back to the "upper" position during transport. NOTE: you can accomplish the same thing by wrapping a piece of duct tape or masking tape around the horn shaft just below the motor plate.
6) After laying the machine on its back, place an old wadded-up towel/rag behind the horn to help cushion it during transport. Not too tight...just enough to support it.

B) A BIT MORE WORK BUT SAFER:

1) Remove the reproducer by turning the knurled sleeve at the top of the horn and gently pulling the reproducer toward the front of the machine.
2) Remove the turntable by pulling it straight up away from the metal motor plate.
3) Turn the speed control knob to "off" or "0".
4) Move the horn all the way to the right, then lower the horn by positioning the wooden lever in an upright position.
5) Remove the two screws holding the lid support to the inside of the lid, and carefully open lid against a support behind the machine (such as a wall, helpful friend, complaining spouse, etc.). DO NOT ALLOW LID TO GO HORIZONTALLY BACKWARDS OR HINGE DAMAGE WILL RESULT.
6) Remove the two screws holding the wooden surround, and remove this.
7) Remove the three motor plate securing nuts/bolts from their lugs.
8) The entire mechanism (including horn)can now be lifted bodily straight up and out of the cabinet. It can be laid on either side for transport, but be careful with the horn.

Hope this is helpful.

George P.

[fran604g]

Hi Blake,

Your Chippendale is a very early one!

About a year ago I began collecting data (for a research project) on certain characteristics that the C 250 and C 19 had featured in their construction over the lifetime of the Chippendale Model. When you get settled in with your "new" Chippendale, would you be willing to provide me with the following information?

If you would rather, you can PM me your information.

Thank you,
Fran

1. Model Designation: (C-250 or C-19)

2. Serial Number:

3. Bedplate Pinstriping: Y/N

4. "Official Laboratory" Medallion: Round/Pentagonal/None

5. Exact Wording of the Medallion: Please be precise (Abbreviated signature, for example)

6. Record Storage: Drawers or Shelves?

7. Cabinet Wood Type: Mahogany or Oak?

8. Duncan Stop?: Y/N

9. Dealer Tag: Name/Address, Location On Machine

10. Original Dated Sales Receipt/Shipping Documentation, etc.: (Dates are particularly noteworthy):

11. Grille cloth? Color?

[lucius1958]

Very nice!

Moving the machine depends on what resources you have: when I acquired my C-250, all I had was my own muscle, a few screwdrivers, a couple of cardboard boxes, and a Toyota Corolla.

It will be easiest to handle if you get to work on it.

Remove the drawers ( it's preferable to move any records therein to a separate box) by pulling them out and carefully tilting them upward, until you can get them out of the case. These can be stowed in your trunk. Remove the grille as well.

Remove the reproducer, and put it in a safe place, with plenty of cushioning around it. Remove the turntable as well, as described elsewhere.

Unscrew and remove the wooden frame around the motor plate; then unbolt the motor & plate from its mounts (Catch the nuts as they come loose, and store them in an appropriate container).

If you have a big enough box handy, you can lift the motor and horn assembly out of the cabinet and stow them there: the alternative is to unbolt the lift lever assembly from the horn pivot tube (you'll need a wrench - or at least a good pair of pliers - for this). You can either stow the horn in another box, or leave it in the cabinet.

With the drawers and the motor out, the cabinet should now be light enough to lift into your vehicle (with a little help): If you do not have a large van, I can attest that a C-250 cabinet, minus the casters, will *just* fit into the back seat of a Corolla.

If you have a hand truck at home, that will be a great help in transporting the case from your car to your designated destination.

I hope these little details may be of use.

BillS

[fran604g]

Another helpful hint that George has shown me: take an old 28" bicycle tire inner tube, cut off the stem, and now you have a very large rubber band that you can use to wrap around the unit from top to bottom to secure the lid.

Use a child's bike inner tube to secure the lower cabinet record storage compartment door.

Fran

[c2506155]

George, Bill, and Fran,

Thanks for all the tips! I get off work in a few hours and am headed over to the estate sale to pick up the unit today. I'm going to go with George's "Option B" because the extra work is worth the time spent.

I have all my tools and boxes ready, plenty of heavy folder type envelopes for small parts/screws/etc, a few instructional YouTube videos bookmarked, and of course I'll be taking plenty of pictures along the way. It looks like each of the three mounting brackets has one or two pieces of cloth (Felt?) acting as vibration dampers I suppose. I really want to be sure I get those back in the same way so the photos are for that as well.

I try and post a few tonight.

Thanks again,

Blake

[fran604g]

Good luck, Blake! I like your choice best, actually. It might be a bit more work, but what you learn through the experience is worth the extra time, IMHO.

Yes, the felt is to isolate vibrations from the motor-plate being conducted to the cabinet. At least in theory, I believe.

Fran