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Post by lucius1958 on Aug 28, 2022 19:56:49 GMT -5
There's a free article on the Antique Phonograph Society website: "Edison C-250 and C-19 Monthly Production Estimates 1915-1925", by Francis W. Pratt. You may be able to get some decent info from there. Francis is also on the Talking Machine Forum, and would welcome entering your machine into the database.
The C-250 is an 'upright' phonograph: the 'console' version would have been named the CC-33 (iirc), and had record storage on either side of the horn. The C-250/C-19 was fairly high up in the model range, but still sold well. There were a number of more expensive models: some of the "Art Case" models cost nearly $1000.
- BillS
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Post by lucius1958 on Aug 26, 2022 19:22:47 GMT -5
You're welcome!
The knurled knob on the left is pushed in or pulled out to change the gearing.
BillS
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Post by lucius1958 on Aug 25, 2022 20:49:29 GMT -5
OK: that's a Model B Standard, probably 1906/7 (the 'Edison' decal was introduced sometime in 1906, and the 'signature' trade mark was redesigned around 1907). George F. Paul has a partial list of Edison serial number data, and might be able to tell you approximately when it left the factory. The combination 2/4 minute gearing was added after 1908; there should be a sloping gear cover over that, which should not be too hard to find.
It looks like you have an H (4 minute) reproducer on it: what condition is it in? With that rebuilt, and adding a C (2 minute) reproducer as well, you should be able to play most cylinders commonly available: black wax, wax Amberols, and Blue Amberols, as well as 2 and 4 minute Indestructibles and Everlastings, by changing the reproducer and setting the gearing appropriately.
Good luck and happy cranking!
BillS
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Post by lucius1958 on Aug 24, 2022 19:16:49 GMT -5
Photos would help.
BillS
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Post by lucius1958 on Aug 5, 2022 21:48:24 GMT -5
From the date of sale, I assume this Fireside is a Model B (4 minute only). It may have been older store stock, as Edison stopped manufacturing outside horn phonographs the previous year. The factory fire of December 1914 wiped out the previous models; when production resumed, they offered a new, redesigned line of internal horn Amberolas and Diamond Disc machines.
- BillS
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Post by lucius1958 on Aug 2, 2022 21:04:46 GMT -5
A secondary cylinder cabinet would be a good choice: they can be a bit expensive, though. Perhaps a chest of drawers (if the drawers are deep enough), or a set of shelves?
As for the crank: it sounds as if you're having trouble with the winding pawl. A proper repair is far better than any stopgap measures.
BTW, what model is it? I assume it's a floor model Amberola of some type.
- BillS
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Post by lucius1958 on Jul 16, 2022 22:02:33 GMT -5
Does yours have an external speed control on the motor plate? I have an early model, and I believe they moved it under the plate later on.
I don't know why they did that: either as a misguided attempt at economy, or an underhanded way of discouraging users from buying lateral records and adapters. You may have to get under there to adjust the governor.
BillS
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Post by lucius1958 on Jun 17, 2022 20:37:03 GMT -5
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Post by lucius1958 on Jun 8, 2022 22:15:45 GMT -5
Great! Enjoy!
BillS
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Post by lucius1958 on Jun 6, 2022 21:26:33 GMT -5
Hi! I just inherited an Edison Standard and a large number of records. I've been told that it belonged to my grandfather (possibly my great grandfather?). I've spent some time poking at it, adjusting the little spindles that hold the mandrel and getting gears lined up correctly, and it seems to play great! I only have a 2m reproducer, but have a BUNCH of 4m records so I need to find another reproducer... Is there a manual/guide online somewhere that covers maintenance/general quesions? For example, is it best to store it with the spring under any pressure, or totally unwound? Inquiring minds want to know... James Does it have 2/4 minute gearing? (photos of the machine would help) If so, you should probably post a 'Wanted' ad - preferably on the Talking Machine Forum, which has a lot more traffic than this site. A good H reproducer should not be too hard to find. Either the TMF or the APS (Antique Phonograph Society) site will probably have links to service manuals for the Standard: you may have to join up to get that content, though. Most collectors agree that you should let the spring wind down after each session playing the machine. With cylinder phonographs, it's fine to let it wind down completely - with disc machines, though, there is a slight difference of opinion. BillS
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Post by lucius1958 on May 26, 2022 23:18:13 GMT -5
To expand: the Automatic recorder was a delicate instrument, and deserves to be rebuilt as original.
The diaphragm was originally of thin French glass, with the link glued on: manuals of the period suggest exchanging different thicknesses, depending on the type of recording one wished to make. Aluminum from a beer can is probably not the best choice: mica might work, but that is doubtful.
Also, the butt end of the old sapphire is not going to work well: it was not polished to a sharp enough edge to make a good cut. Sapphires were offered in either a 'flat' end, or a 'cupped' end: the cupped end is generally better. I have read of using a glass rod of the right diameter to replace a missing sapphire; but glass will not last as long as sapphire.
Again: you would do best to trade the Automatic for a good, later style recorder.
BillS
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Post by lucius1958 on May 18, 2022 21:41:40 GMT -5
All in all, your best bet is to get a later style recorder, and sell the Automatic to someone with the means to do a proper restoration on it.
The later recorders are not too hard to find, although they are often missing the stylus: I have heard of some folks offering replacement styli, but you'd have to check. Perhaps if you contacted Wyatt Markus, he might be able to find you a good recorder in partial trade for the Automatic. I don't know how he is with recorders, but he's a perfect whiz with reproducers... I hope this is of some slight help.
BillS
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Post by lucius1958 on May 14, 2022 20:44:03 GMT -5
Nice restoration!
BillS
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Post by lucius1958 on May 9, 2022 21:42:03 GMT -5
Most likely it needs a new mainspring. DD springs are rather daunting to work on, so it's best to send them to an experienced restorer.
The C-19 has a double spring motor, so it would be best to replace both of them. (Note: the prefix before the serial number is "SM" [Spring Motor] )
There's a "Database of C-250/C-19 Phonographs" on the Talking Machine Forum, where you can learn the approximate date of your machine. They also have a list of restorers & parts suppliers. The folks at TMF are generally quite helpful, and can steer you in the right direction to get your machine playing again.
I don't know how much work the previous restorer did on it before they passed away; but the mechanism should be thoroughly disassembled, cleaned, and re-lubricated to perform at its best. The reproducer should be looked at as well, and the gaskets, diaphragm, and stylus replaced if needed. (Diamond styli can be expensive, but worn or chipped ones will damage records).
If you feel confident enough to do some of your own work, there's a great book, "The Compleat Talking Machine", by Eric L. Reiss, which gives excellent advice on restoration techniques: it's something of a bible among phonograph collectors.
I hope this has been helpful.
- BillS
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Post by lucius1958 on Apr 17, 2022 21:03:32 GMT -5
Have you ever cleaned the motor? Old oil can get gummy. Have you checked the mainspring? The grease can lose its viscosity after 100 years, and springs can get 'tired' as well. Perhaps you can send it out for service (DD springs are rather a chore to work with). How's the horn height? Not sure if that would affect the speed, but it's best to make sure.
Hope these suggestions may be of some help.
- BillS
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